.10 Caliber (potential/future)
.12 Caliber (potential/future)
.14 Caliber (potential/future)
.17 Caliber:
.17"x28mm AKA 4.5x28mm
4.4x28mm
4.7x28mm (Typo?)
17 Velociraptor - based upon the same case, but not the same magazine system. (Bolt action rifles usually)
25 gr vmax bullet from a rifle @3200 fps
18 gr bullet @ 3652 fps.
.19 Caliber:
4.85x28mm AKA .19"x28mm (Using Jim Calhoun's bullets) - conceptual stage only.
.20 Caliber:
.20 Shrike,
.204 short
5mm Shrike - based upon the same case, but not the same magazine system. (Bolt action rifles usually)
.243 Caliber (potential/future)
.25 Caliber (potential/future)
.270 Caliber (potential/future)
.280 Caliber (potential/future)
(would have just about straight walled case)
http://www.varminter.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php?t7230.html
Posted by HarleyD Oct 8 2005, 04:11 PM
well guys i think i have finally come up with the perfect fox/small game rifle cartridge combo.
the rifle is the cz 527, originaly in 22 hornet. we chambered it for the 5.7X28 fn round necked down to 17 caliber.
as you guys know i have harvested a fox or two in my life. this brought me to the conclusion, a 20/25 grain 17 caliber bullet traveling at 3000 fps will go in and not come out. thus preserving the value of the fur without becoming a seamstress, i hate sewing up holes.
the 17x28 produces 3000+ with both bullets on less than 10 grains of powder. that translates into 700 shots per pound of powder. thst makes it about as cost effective as the 17 hmr but with real slam there butts into the ground performance.
here is my test results.
Powder charge bullet weight velocity group
WW 680 9.4 Hornady vmax 20 3359 .62
WW 680 9.6 Hornady vmax 20 3430 1.51
WW 680 9.8 Hornady vmax 20 3547 .51
WW 680 10.1 Hornady vmax 20 3642 .43
aa1680 9.4 Hornady vmax 25 2911 5/.43 4/.33
aa1680 9.6 Hornady vmax 25 3077 .62
aa1680 9.8 Hornady vmax 25 3090 .55
aa1680 10.1 Hornady vmax 25 3112
aa1680 10.2 Hornady vmax 25 3166 .50
aa1680 10.3 Hornady vmax 25 3208 .48
aa1680 10.3 Hornady vmax 25 3132 1.026
aa1680 10.3 Hornady vmax 25 3162 .674
aa1680 10.3 Hornady vmax 25 3199 .750
aa1680 10.3 Hornady vmax 25 3238 .924
n120 8.8 Hornady vmax 20 2993 .822
n120 9.0 Hornady vmax 20 3087 .755
n120 9.2 Hornady vmax 20 3127 .57
n120 9.5 Hornady vmax 20 3283 .461
n120 9.7 Hornady vmax 20 3312 .2
n120 9.9 Hornady vmax 20 33384 .293
Posted by foxhunter:
the 17x28 is a version of paul rodgers 4.4X28, based on the FN 5.7X28 machine gun and pistol round. basicly it's a 17 ccm on viagra or a limp 17 ah. the cartridge may very well be the best fox round. if the case will deliver 3000 fps with a 25 gr bullet, it will march everybodies blue dot loads for the 17 Mach 4 and 17 remington. instand death with 0 pelt damage, a fox hunters dream.
http://www.fortliberty.org/military-library/fn-5.7.shtml
Wednesday, June 28, 2006
TDI Arms rail system for the P90
TPR16 -Side-by-Side Picatinny Rail System for Front Sight of P90. price $59.99
$71.99
Product Code: TPR16
Aluminum Side by Side Picatinny Rails for Front Sight of P90
Enables the secure mounting of light and laser devices on the front sight of M16/AR15/M4
Gunsmithing is required!
Constructed of billet aviation grade aluminum using CNC machinery
Lifetime Warranty
$71.99
Product Code: TPR16
Aluminum Side by Side Picatinny Rails for Front Sight of P90
Enables the secure mounting of light and laser devices on the front sight of M16/AR15/M4
Gunsmithing is required!
Constructed of billet aviation grade aluminum using CNC machinery
Lifetime Warranty
Bullet Forge's silver bullets
Here is the promised update.
The top two are silver plated brass with solid sterling silver bullets (inert). They are promised for Warwolf if he still wants them.
Of the bottom five with normal brass, four of them are actually live bullets (I can't sell those yet legally). All with Standard FN brass using recipes from this board.
For those curious about actually shooting silver bullets.
Silver is actually harder than lead. Its hardness is in the area of solid copper bullets depending on how you make it. Several comapnies are now selling solid copper bullets, just not for the FN! I have shot a few of the silver bullets in .44, .223 and 9mm. They seem to do fine but I still don't know how to remove silvering from the barell.
The top two are silver plated brass with solid sterling silver bullets (inert). They are promised for Warwolf if he still wants them.
Of the bottom five with normal brass, four of them are actually live bullets (I can't sell those yet legally). All with Standard FN brass using recipes from this board.
For those curious about actually shooting silver bullets.
Silver is actually harder than lead. Its hardness is in the area of solid copper bullets depending on how you make it. Several comapnies are now selling solid copper bullets, just not for the FN! I have shot a few of the silver bullets in .44, .223 and 9mm. They seem to do fine but I still don't know how to remove silvering from the barell.
Tuesday, June 27, 2006
Inexpensive green laser
Tactical Green Dot Laser Aim Kit
-Included with Pressure Pad
-Suitable for any Rifle, Shotgun, Pistol, SMG, AEG grenade launcher
-Standard X-Y Windage and Levitation click adjustment
-Included a 20mm Weaver mount suitable for Weaver 20mm Rail
Wave Length: 532 nm
Range: 8000 yard
Beam Divergence: <1.2 (mrad)
Beam Diameter in dark: 1 (mm)
Material: Aluminium
Battery: 1 X Surefire SF123A battery (included)
Length: 11 cm
Weight: 300g
-Included with Pressure Pad
-Suitable for any Rifle, Shotgun, Pistol, SMG, AEG grenade launcher
-Standard X-Y Windage and Levitation click adjustment
-Included a 20mm Weaver mount suitable for Weaver 20mm Rail
Wave Length: 532 nm
Range: 8000 yard
Beam Divergence: <1.2 (mrad)
Beam Diameter in dark: 1 (mm)
Material: Aluminium
Battery: 1 X Surefire SF123A battery (included)
Length: 11 cm
Weight: 300g
PS90 SBR Howto
Various howtos. Your mileage may vary. Use at your own risk. Do not blame me if you're unhappy with the results. Do not blame the original posters if you are unhappy with the results. Look to your own actions and own them and realize that happiness comes from within.
UPDATE 07/21/2006 CMMG has posted detailed instructions (with lots of pictures) on the FiveseveN Forum - READ THIS FIRST: http://fivesevenforum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=41652&postcount=1
JUST IN CASE YOU MISSED IT - READ CMMG's HOWTO in the link above.
Posted by tctrld:
Tools:
Dremel
15mm wrench
Vise
Punch
1. Disassemble PS90. Time for this: 1:00 minute
2. I used my dremel to reveal the other side of the pin on the shroud. (using a cutting attachment in an 'scraping' motion) - time for this 1:00 minute
3. Tap out the pin using a punch and hammer. Time for this: 0:10 seconds
4. I mounted the receiver assembly in my vise, vice jaws grabbing on to the flash hider. Use a 15mm wrench and apply force. NOTE! Turn clock-wise as it's reverse threaded. Barrel separated from flash hider after a few light taps with the palm of my hand. Time for this: 1:00 minute
5. Re-assemble with CMMG 10.3" barrel and P90 flash hider. Time for this 1:00 minute.
It is easier that it looks/sounds. The barrel has milled flats at the breach end for a 15mm wrench. The barrel screws into the flash hider only. Nothing screws into the receiver. The barrel assembly is under spring load between it and the receiver. That's why you can push on the muzzle and have it give for about 1/4"
Posted by fenemij:
Here is the info i have on the bbl/FH torque specs:
John at CMMG said 65FT LBS
FN manual says 40Nm to 50Nm
1Nm=0.737562149 FT LB
So if my math is correct that would be 29.5FT LB to 36.8FT LB
Posted by CMMG:
The thread is 12x1 LH. Secure the sleeve and chamber (15mm wrench) and unscrew the hider. Drill out the blind pin then unscrew the barrel. My first one wasn't pretty, I got the barrel and hider bound together because I didn't have everything secured like it was supposed to. You can do it a really fast way and just chop the old barrel off with a band saw and then the barrel will just fall out.
Posted by Halo Mfg:
When you do it, be commited to finish. In our case we followed jeffs instructions and ran into a snag. It wasn't his fault. The flash hider started to unthread then suddendly got stuck. We made the decision to continue and destroyed the threads on just under half of the barrel.
What happened was the threading on the hider bound and the pin ruined the rest of the threads. My gun was F---ked. I couldn't put the barrel cover back on (due to the threads) and now the only barrel I had to put on it was CMMG's (wich fit and functions perfect by the way). I finally designed a new fake suppressor to replace the barrel cover. So I wouldn't have to make it an SBR to take it home.
Everythings better now, but it won't ever have the original look again (FN will fix and re-pin it, but won't sell the barrel or extention.)
If anyone does change out there barrel (and has it and the cover with hider availiable). let me know ill buy it!
So the moral of the story is "I would suggest drilling out the pin, before doing anything"!!!
Posted by darkest2000:
Originally Posted by brazos609
So it looks like you just turned the wrench on the chamber area of the barrel and let the flat at the end of the sleeve stop against the receiver, kinda just chewed away the threads at the muzzle?
Nope, you might risk damaging the receiver that way, what I did was I threw the 15mm wrench on the chamber area then secure the wrench onto a vise, then you clamp down the flash hider/sleeve with a vise grip/slip joint plier and turn it clockwise (to unscrew), this way all the stress from the torque stays on the barrel/sleeve and not on the receiver.
The threads on the muzzle looks chewed away because I didn't completely remove the pin (long story) and that's just kinda how it turned out after I was done. It was a major chore for me because part of the pin got caught somewhere within the threads so it made unscrewing the sleeve extremely tedious. If the pin is completely removed like it should have been I don't think it's going to be that difficult at all as soon as the sleeve loosens.
Moral of the story: Be sure you completely remove the pin before you do anything or you'll have a tough life.
Posted by Brontes:
If anyone is going to post instructions on this forum and they are wrong, how could it not be their fault?
Everyone knows you need to take out the pin first. CMMG simply posted the wrong instructions, you followed them and wrecked your gun.
Destructions:
1. Remove the pin (best thing to do is to drill from the other side and tap it out. The pin goes almost all the way through)
2. Clamp the sleve - brake loose hider. Hider goes on right hand thread into the sleve !!!! 1/2 turn is enough to loosen it (use torch to heat up parts)
3. Clamp the hider and turn out the barrel - barrel is in the hider left hand thread!
This is where you will most likely break the receiver - UNLESS - you turn the barrel on it's axis. The simplest way to do this is to have a custom 15 mm wrench with handles on either side, so you can turn on center and not bend the barrel. The barrel is chromoly steel, it flexes quite a bit. If you yank on it while the hider is in the clamp, you run the rick of stressing the receiver and cracking it (as some on this forum have done).
To make one of these, slim down an automotive 15 mm wrench (only the jaw part)and weld on a handle.
4. Separate hider from sleeve (they are already loose)
Contrary to popular belief on this forum - the barrel is NOT threaded to the sleeve - only to the hider.
You need:
1. Milling machine (heavy duty)
2. AR 16 barrel clamp
3. Heavy duty vise
4. Propane torch
5. Carbide Milling bits
6. Custom made 15mm wrench (slimmed down automotive with opposing handle)
7. Custom made hardened steel plate that you can insert trough the hider and whack it (to loosen the sleve from the hider)
8. Mig welder (for the wrench)
So, unless you have all the equipment above - give it to a gunsmith that does and knows what he/she is doing. Be were - there are quacks out there.
In Retrospect:
Many members here have been hacking their barrels off. Keep in mind - FN will NOT sell you a spare 16" barrel or a sleve or a hider (they are all going on guns).
If they did, barrel is $600.00, sleeve is $150 and so is the hider. Near close to $1,000 of replacement parts MSRP.
So, if you have destroyed the barrel, hider and sleeve with a hacksaw ($900), paid CMMG for a short barrel ($275) and a new hider $95 and a $200.00 for the ATF stamp - you just bought yourself another PS90. Instead, you have a weapon that Hillary now knows you have - and one with inferior ballistics to the PS90.
Posted by Sua Sponte:
OR --
you can take a $5 hack saw and just cut behind the pin on the sleeve about 1" -- the old barrel will then fall out the breech end, hit the floor, and go "ping-ping-ping" until it comes to a stop.
ohhhh, and while the ballistics may be marginally superior, the SBR version is way cooler looking!!!! let's be honest, the PS90 looks like a broom! LOL!
Posted by CLC3251:
First remove the pin holding the flash hider on. You can grind out a relief cut as Mark did or drill it out. Either way, remove the entire pin. There is no way to do it without maring the barrel extension. If you took a really long time, you cold carefully drill/grind away the opposite side of the sleeve from the pin and carefully drive it out. Once the pin is removed, don't try to unscrew the flash hider from the sleeve, it will not come out. Take a 15mm open ended box wrench and grind down the sides so that it will fit in the groove in the chamber end of the barrel. Most standard wrenches will not fit as the groove is tight and if you try to force it you will mar the barrel. Unscrew the barrel from the flash hider. It has left hand threads, so turn it clockwise to remove it. An easy way is to wrap the flash hider in a few layers of paper and clamp it in a pair of aluminum AR-15 barrel blocks to hold it without marring it. Watch the front of the receiver as once the hider/sleeve unscrews a certain amount, it can rotate and scratch the front of the receiver. Once it unscrews from the flash hider, you can pull the hider/sleeve off of the front of the barrel. Watch carefully as there is a spring between the sleeve and the receiver around the barrel that you will need to put back when you re-asemble or replace with a short barrel and hider. Pull the barrel out of the back of the receiver carefully as the recoil spring is around the barrel and the spring loaded takedown button is near the back That's it. You can separate the flash hider from ther sleeve by unscrewing it but it is right hand thread so unscrew it counter clockwise. The two different thread turns is what prevents you from unscrewing the hider first. The barrel only screws into the flash hider, but the flash hider screws into both the barrel and the sleeve which prevents it from being removed first.
UPDATE 07/21/2006 CMMG has posted detailed instructions (with lots of pictures) on the FiveseveN Forum - READ THIS FIRST: http://fivesevenforum.com/forums/showpost.php?p=41652&postcount=1
JUST IN CASE YOU MISSED IT - READ CMMG's HOWTO in the link above.
Posted by tctrld:
Tools:
Dremel
15mm wrench
Vise
Punch
1. Disassemble PS90. Time for this: 1:00 minute
2. I used my dremel to reveal the other side of the pin on the shroud. (using a cutting attachment in an 'scraping' motion) - time for this 1:00 minute
3. Tap out the pin using a punch and hammer. Time for this: 0:10 seconds
4. I mounted the receiver assembly in my vise, vice jaws grabbing on to the flash hider. Use a 15mm wrench and apply force. NOTE! Turn clock-wise as it's reverse threaded. Barrel separated from flash hider after a few light taps with the palm of my hand. Time for this: 1:00 minute
5. Re-assemble with CMMG 10.3" barrel and P90 flash hider. Time for this 1:00 minute.
It is easier that it looks/sounds. The barrel has milled flats at the breach end for a 15mm wrench. The barrel screws into the flash hider only. Nothing screws into the receiver. The barrel assembly is under spring load between it and the receiver. That's why you can push on the muzzle and have it give for about 1/4"
Posted by fenemij:
Here is the info i have on the bbl/FH torque specs:
John at CMMG said 65FT LBS
FN manual says 40Nm to 50Nm
1Nm=0.737562149 FT LB
So if my math is correct that would be 29.5FT LB to 36.8FT LB
Posted by CMMG:
The thread is 12x1 LH. Secure the sleeve and chamber (15mm wrench) and unscrew the hider. Drill out the blind pin then unscrew the barrel. My first one wasn't pretty, I got the barrel and hider bound together because I didn't have everything secured like it was supposed to. You can do it a really fast way and just chop the old barrel off with a band saw and then the barrel will just fall out.
Posted by Halo Mfg:
When you do it, be commited to finish. In our case we followed jeffs instructions and ran into a snag. It wasn't his fault. The flash hider started to unthread then suddendly got stuck. We made the decision to continue and destroyed the threads on just under half of the barrel.
What happened was the threading on the hider bound and the pin ruined the rest of the threads. My gun was F---ked. I couldn't put the barrel cover back on (due to the threads) and now the only barrel I had to put on it was CMMG's (wich fit and functions perfect by the way). I finally designed a new fake suppressor to replace the barrel cover. So I wouldn't have to make it an SBR to take it home.
Everythings better now, but it won't ever have the original look again (FN will fix and re-pin it, but won't sell the barrel or extention.)
If anyone does change out there barrel (and has it and the cover with hider availiable). let me know ill buy it!
So the moral of the story is "I would suggest drilling out the pin, before doing anything"!!!
Posted by darkest2000:
Originally Posted by brazos609
So it looks like you just turned the wrench on the chamber area of the barrel and let the flat at the end of the sleeve stop against the receiver, kinda just chewed away the threads at the muzzle?
Nope, you might risk damaging the receiver that way, what I did was I threw the 15mm wrench on the chamber area then secure the wrench onto a vise, then you clamp down the flash hider/sleeve with a vise grip/slip joint plier and turn it clockwise (to unscrew), this way all the stress from the torque stays on the barrel/sleeve and not on the receiver.
The threads on the muzzle looks chewed away because I didn't completely remove the pin (long story) and that's just kinda how it turned out after I was done. It was a major chore for me because part of the pin got caught somewhere within the threads so it made unscrewing the sleeve extremely tedious. If the pin is completely removed like it should have been I don't think it's going to be that difficult at all as soon as the sleeve loosens.
Moral of the story: Be sure you completely remove the pin before you do anything or you'll have a tough life.
Posted by Brontes:
If anyone is going to post instructions on this forum and they are wrong, how could it not be their fault?
Everyone knows you need to take out the pin first. CMMG simply posted the wrong instructions, you followed them and wrecked your gun.
Destructions:
1. Remove the pin (best thing to do is to drill from the other side and tap it out. The pin goes almost all the way through)
2. Clamp the sleve - brake loose hider. Hider goes on right hand thread into the sleve !!!! 1/2 turn is enough to loosen it (use torch to heat up parts)
3. Clamp the hider and turn out the barrel - barrel is in the hider left hand thread!
This is where you will most likely break the receiver - UNLESS - you turn the barrel on it's axis. The simplest way to do this is to have a custom 15 mm wrench with handles on either side, so you can turn on center and not bend the barrel. The barrel is chromoly steel, it flexes quite a bit. If you yank on it while the hider is in the clamp, you run the rick of stressing the receiver and cracking it (as some on this forum have done).
To make one of these, slim down an automotive 15 mm wrench (only the jaw part)and weld on a handle.
4. Separate hider from sleeve (they are already loose)
Contrary to popular belief on this forum - the barrel is NOT threaded to the sleeve - only to the hider.
You need:
1. Milling machine (heavy duty)
2. AR 16 barrel clamp
3. Heavy duty vise
4. Propane torch
5. Carbide Milling bits
6. Custom made 15mm wrench (slimmed down automotive with opposing handle)
7. Custom made hardened steel plate that you can insert trough the hider and whack it (to loosen the sleve from the hider)
8. Mig welder (for the wrench)
So, unless you have all the equipment above - give it to a gunsmith that does and knows what he/she is doing. Be were - there are quacks out there.
In Retrospect:
Many members here have been hacking their barrels off. Keep in mind - FN will NOT sell you a spare 16" barrel or a sleve or a hider (they are all going on guns).
If they did, barrel is $600.00, sleeve is $150 and so is the hider. Near close to $1,000 of replacement parts MSRP.
So, if you have destroyed the barrel, hider and sleeve with a hacksaw ($900), paid CMMG for a short barrel ($275) and a new hider $95 and a $200.00 for the ATF stamp - you just bought yourself another PS90. Instead, you have a weapon that Hillary now knows you have - and one with inferior ballistics to the PS90.
Posted by Sua Sponte:
OR --
you can take a $5 hack saw and just cut behind the pin on the sleeve about 1" -- the old barrel will then fall out the breech end, hit the floor, and go "ping-ping-ping" until it comes to a stop.
ohhhh, and while the ballistics may be marginally superior, the SBR version is way cooler looking!!!! let's be honest, the PS90 looks like a broom! LOL!
Posted by CLC3251:
First remove the pin holding the flash hider on. You can grind out a relief cut as Mark did or drill it out. Either way, remove the entire pin. There is no way to do it without maring the barrel extension. If you took a really long time, you cold carefully drill/grind away the opposite side of the sleeve from the pin and carefully drive it out. Once the pin is removed, don't try to unscrew the flash hider from the sleeve, it will not come out. Take a 15mm open ended box wrench and grind down the sides so that it will fit in the groove in the chamber end of the barrel. Most standard wrenches will not fit as the groove is tight and if you try to force it you will mar the barrel. Unscrew the barrel from the flash hider. It has left hand threads, so turn it clockwise to remove it. An easy way is to wrap the flash hider in a few layers of paper and clamp it in a pair of aluminum AR-15 barrel blocks to hold it without marring it. Watch the front of the receiver as once the hider/sleeve unscrews a certain amount, it can rotate and scratch the front of the receiver. Once it unscrews from the flash hider, you can pull the hider/sleeve off of the front of the barrel. Watch carefully as there is a spring between the sleeve and the receiver around the barrel that you will need to put back when you re-asemble or replace with a short barrel and hider. Pull the barrel out of the back of the receiver carefully as the recoil spring is around the barrel and the spring loaded takedown button is near the back That's it. You can separate the flash hider from ther sleeve by unscrewing it but it is right hand thread so unscrew it counter clockwise. The two different thread turns is what prevents you from unscrewing the hider first. The barrel only screws into the flash hider, but the flash hider screws into both the barrel and the sleeve which prevents it from being removed first.
Halo Manufacturing
Various aftermarket parts for the P(S)90 including:
Side rail sets
Tri rail system
Butt stock extension (soon)
Fake suppressor (soon)
Optical/accessory rail for the Five-seveN
Side rail sets
Tri rail system
Butt stock extension (soon)
Fake suppressor (soon)
Optical/accessory rail for the Five-seveN
MagazineParts.Com
Various P(S)90 aftermarket parts, including:
Tactical optic rail
Dual magazine clamp
Forward sling mount
Extended side rail
50 round magazine plate holder
Custom modified nitro quad rail
Tactical optic rail
Dual magazine clamp
Forward sling mount
Extended side rail
50 round magazine plate holder
Custom modified nitro quad rail
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